Page 1 of 2

Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:24 pm
by jonathangkoehn
I'm looking for those that would use a Hebrew Analytical Lexicon.
This module works with Hebrew text that are pointed or un-pointed. Those that have strongs, lemma, morphology or none of these.
It is recommended to set in Bible view options->Word click options-> the actual word being clicked on as last

I would and am but I'm just one person so I'm wondering about others. I need some beta testers to look it over. If you have experience in Hebrew that would be preferable if not but willing to help that would be great as well.

This Hebrew Analytical Lexicon is based on Mr. Eliran Wong's work at Marvel.Bible used with permission.

Please message me through this forum thank you.


There are two editions: Normal and Research
Normal Edition: The topic entry is based only on the pointed Hebrew it has a short definition, strongs, lemma, and a full morphology as well as short morphology.
The built in help explains the entry which is accessed in each entry through the ?
OHAL-Normal.jpg
OHAL-Normal.jpg (109.18 KiB) Viewed 3631 times

Research Edition: The topic entry is based on Consonantal form and various pointed forms that fall under that consonantal form (note these are book marked to the entries inside the content.)
It has for each entry all the possible pointed Hebrew that would come under the same consonantal form.
It also has short definition, strongs, lemma, full morphology and short morphology for each of these entries.
The built in help explains the entry which is accessed in each entry through the ?
OHAL-Research.jpg
OHAL-Research.jpg (200.46 KiB) Viewed 3631 times

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:12 pm
by DarrelW
Jonathan,
I have a passionate interest in Hebrew, am working with Eliran on marvel.bible (testing and writing the docs) and helping test the new Unique bible. I would love to help, but my knowledge of Hebrew does not match my desire yet! So if you want I will do what I can.

Darrel

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 3:04 am
by jonathangkoehn
Sounds great! I'm learning Hebrew as well. Praise God for your passion. I'll email you a link to them.

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 4:34 pm
by JG
I question the coding sequences where there are accents and points.
I am of the understanding that points are encoded before accents. With exceptions? Holam Vav/ Vav Holam
The below example shows a difference between Bibles and the AnLex module, so searches will fail unless you do it without diacritics, which defeats the object doesn't it?
[Excuse typo "differnet"]
0001 Jon theWord_2019-02-09_123028.jpg
0001 Jon theWord_2019-02-09_123028.jpg (266.54 KiB) Viewed 3608 times
0002 Jon theWord_2019-02-09_124108.jpg
0002 Jon theWord_2019-02-09_124108.jpg (92.5 KiB) Viewed 3608 times

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 8:05 pm
by jonathangkoehn
Greetings Jon, Thank you for the detailed observation. Is this something you've found among multiple Bible modules? (Learning about these diacritic orders) What book verse is this test? [Numbers 31:4?]
Also what tool are you using for seeing the pointings order? Is it Babelpad or map? [Edit: I see BabelPad makes this possible]

Thankfully how theWORD is coded a result will be found in the normal edition because the vowel points I believe are stripped and then a match is obtained. Costas? But yes it wouldn't be the diacritics match then which does defeat part of the point yes.

Also the research edition may just match the consonantal version and not the bookmark pointed words in these cases. Which does defeat part of the point.

But I would like to learn more about this. If it is something I can change perhaps.

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 8:41 pm
by jonathangkoehn
Could you check Genesis 20:16 in WHM and HiSB same word. אֶ֤לֶף

Numbers 31:4 seems to be an irregularity. When I search for אֶ֚לֶף from Numbers 31:4 with diacritics on it is the only one of its kind.
Where as the opposite from Genesis 20:16 אֶ֤לֶף has 14 matches. Though I'm not sure there is another one that starts the sentence.

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 8:59 pm
by jonathangkoehn
Darrel did the email make it to you ok?

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:39 pm
by DarrelW
The one with both links? Yes it did

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:45 pm
by DarrelW
I have been a little slow looking at it. I have been heavily buried working Eliran on Unique bible app. :oops:

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:50 pm
by jonathangkoehn
Ah no worries pray it goes well with Eliran Wong and his efforts there. Some good stuff going on. Definitely don't want to take you away from that.

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:04 pm
by JG
jonathangkoehn wrote:Could you check Genesis 20:16 in WHM and HiSB same word. אֶ֤לֶף

Numbers 31:4 seems to be an irregularity. When I search for אֶ֚לֶף from Numbers 31:4 with diacritics on it is the only one of its kind.
Where as the opposite from Genesis 20:16 אֶ֤לֶף has 14 matches. Though I'm not sure there is another one that starts the sentence.

It just seems that the H505 encoding in the AnLex is wrong.

Another one to look at is the uBDB H505 and it is different still. I see this in Logos KJV Bible
0005 Jon theWord_2019-02-09_195306.jpg
0005 Jon theWord_2019-02-09_195306.jpg (17.48 KiB) Viewed 3598 times
0004 Jon theWord_2019-02-09_195231.jpg
0004 Jon theWord_2019-02-09_195231.jpg (45.86 KiB) Viewed 3598 times


Anyway this is beyond my knowledge. As is often said, "A little knowledge is dangerous", and at the moment I am very dangerous.

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:32 pm
by jonathangkoehn
Checked the paper and theWORD edition uBDB and you are correct.
It appears there are various accents used. (I'm in the process of learning these still.)
Here is an accent guide from the Hebrew BHS I found it on wikipedia it also appears like the one in my paper BHS.

One can note on Side A number 11. what we see in Genesis 20:16, Number 31:4
Side B number 2 is very similar to what we see in uBDB.

Side A
Hebrew-Tabula_Accentuum-sideA.jpg
Hebrew-Tabula_Accentuum-sideA.jpg (80.24 KiB) Viewed 3597 times
Side B
Hebrew-Tabula_Accentuum-sideB.jpg
Hebrew-Tabula_Accentuum-sideB.jpg (73.74 KiB) Viewed 3597 times
By the way would these images be helpful in the HebAnLex? Perhaps next to the ? as a á

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:55 pm
by jonathangkoehn
I believe the Masoretic vowel pointing system is the norm but there are some others which may explain for some of the differences.
What you may note is that in Genesis 20:16 the < is done the opposite of Num 31:4 also there are 14 done the way of Genesis 20:16 and only one like Number 31:4. By the way HebAnLex picks up the Gen 20:16 entry correctly but not the Num 31:4.

Which gives rise to at least four possibilities.
1. HebAnLex needs to have another entry for Numbers 31:4 it is another way to render it.
2. All the other 14 instances of this word are wrong and Numbers 31:4 is right
3. Number 31:4 is incorrect.
4. something else (interesting)

The interesting thing about the AnLex modules is they really put the actual word entries to the test. Also it does help check if the AnLex modules need fixed.

Also: It is this way with HiSB, WHM, and the Shorishim.

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 12:07 am
by jonathangkoehn
Just checked my paper BHS it is a variant I need to add. [Edit: Never mind it is there already but something is up. I'll see what I can do.]

Re: Open Hebrew Analytical Lexicon

Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 12:38 am
by jonathangkoehn
The original data had the < in the wrong spot. Thanks for sticking with me on this one Jon.